ND maybe making a run at Jim Knowles?
by Romulox, Thursday, January 23, 2025, 18:59 (14 days ago)
https://footballscoop.com/news/sources-fresh-off-a-national-title-jim-knowles-now-being...
Is football scoop a legit source?
Quote: "At about 3 p.m. today," one industry source told FootballScoop, "he had (Ryan) Day, (James) Franklin, (Brent) Venables and (Marcus) Freeman pissed off at him."
Update per the Irish Illustrated pod today
by Jeremy (WeIsND), Offices of Babip Pecota Vorp & Eckstein, Friday, January 24, 2025, 13:19 (13 days ago) @ Romulox
Brice and Sampson confirmed that ND is looking outside the staff, at least for now. Confirmed the contact with Knowles. Also suggested that there might be an opportunity for Co-DCs with Mickens staying.
Reading between the lines, not clear that Mickens is enthused about that. Brice made some cryptic comments about anticipating that Golden likely won't be the only departure from the staff.
Regarding other targets, Leonhard was mentioned by a few guys. Apparently he was Freeman's #1 target a few years back before they settled on Golden. Also discussed the IU DC, but it sounds like he's likely to stay in Bloomington. Has been approached by PSU a few times and looks to be staying.
No other real targets mentioned by name. I will point out that when the beats (non-Brice guys here) "know something," they often don't mention names or even hint about names, presumably on the direction of their sources in the Gug. I wonder if they were making inroads on a guy like Kwiatowski whether they'd keep it under wraps for now. Something to think about.
Personal anecdote - I have a guy in my neighborhood who played at Wisconsin with Leonhard. Doesn't keep in close contact with him, but does talk to people who do. He would be surprised if Leonhard took the ND job, and if he'd return to college at all, unless he was offered the Wisconsin head gig. Even with the Badgers there's some lingering bad feelings apparently.
I don't recall much Leonhard consideration last time around
by Domer99, John Wesley Powell's Expedition Island, Friday, January 24, 2025, 14:46 (13 days ago) @ Jeremy (WeIsND)
And remember being somewhat annoyed by it. Certainly Sampson didn't recall it because I took the names from his article 3 years ago.
This...though...this is interesting.....
Buckeye fans are so butthurt over Knowles enteraining offers
by KGB, Belly o. the Beast, Friday, January 24, 2025, 15:51 (13 days ago) @ Domer99
In no way does it make up for losing the game, but I'll take my schadenfreude where I can get it.
"THIS IS THE ULTIMATE JOB WHY WOULD ANYONE EVER LEAVE"
Also had an illuminating conversation about how other schools are tampering with Smith and Tate but their acquisition of Downs and Judkins was TOTALLY on the up-and-up. I try to be gracious in defeat, but the shit is exhausting, man.
And now Brice is reporting USC is after Bowden
by Jeremy (WeIsND), Offices of Babip Pecota Vorp & Eckstein, Friday, January 24, 2025, 13:28 (13 days ago) @ Jeremy (WeIsND)
Willing to pay him $1MM to be their GM. Apparently ND is paying him up to $300K, so its hard to see ND matching this.
Some minus points on Knowles
by Mike (bart), Friday, January 24, 2025, 08:03 (13 days ago) @ Romulox
1. Really got worked by Harbaugh in '22
2. Not a great showing against Harbaugh in '23
3. Could very easily have given up 30 to ND on Monday with the most talented D in the nation
He's good but he's not bulletproof
No DC is bulletproof
by BPH, San Diego, Friday, January 24, 2025, 10:13 (13 days ago) @ Mike (bart)
What I like is that in 2021, he built the nation's second-best defense at the other OSU - three years before he built the best defense in the nation. The guy can work wonders with a unit full of 5-star studs and a unit full of scrappy underdogs.
Candidates last time around
by Domer99, John Wesley Powell's Expedition Island, Friday, January 24, 2025, 07:47 (13 days ago) @ Romulox
Obviously Mike Elston was auditioning. Jon Heacock got a token interview via aOSU connections.
But last go round the primary candidates according to Sampson were:
Doug Belk
Tony Gibson
Al Golden
Tem Lukabu
Derek Mason
Phil Parker
Joe Rossi
seems like Freeman is at least considering a grayhair DC
by HumanRobot , Cybertron, Friday, January 24, 2025, 07:16 (13 days ago) @ Romulox
From my perspective, that makes sense. When you have premium capital available, you shouldn't have coordinators learning on the job. If you promote Mickens to DC, you're still losing an elite DB coach since someone else has to take over. Some of the names I've seen:
- Knowles -- duh
- Leonhard -- I forgot how good his defenses were at Wisconsin
- Jeff Choate -- current Nevada HC, former Texas DC. Could also possibly blend with Mickens as co-DC focusing on back half.
- Haines -- strong IU DC, excellent at front 7. Same idea as Choate
- Eberflus -- this is a Tim original, but Eberflus was a really good DC at Missouri and a great recruiter there. Could possibly be an upgrade as "playcalling, gameplanning DC" over Golden that would benefit from Freeman taking on the culture/accountability stuff
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I'm a bad take machine!
If we're going after Knowles, why not Kwiatowski
by GloveND, Friday, January 24, 2025, 09:05 (13 days ago) @ HumanRobot
Yes, I am sure he is getting paid a TON at Texas, BUT he apparently grew up a HUGE ND fan. I think he made a comment or two about loving to coach at ND someday.
that's a very good name
by HumanRobot , Cybertron, Friday, January 24, 2025, 10:29 (13 days ago) @ GloveND
If we're in the conversation with Knowles, that means we'll go $3-3.5 million on a DC. If Knowles says no, go down the list of best DCs.
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I'm a bad take machine!
Maybe he's next depending on what Knowles decides
by BPH, San Diego, Friday, January 24, 2025, 10:26 (13 days ago) @ GloveND
In any event, if Mickens wasn't the guy immediately, I'm starting to doubt he'll be the guy eventually. Hopefully Freeman can pull off some Hartline magic and still retain him.
Freeman does like to take his shot
by BPH, San Diego, Friday, January 24, 2025, 07:47 (13 days ago) @ HumanRobot
Think about going after Hartline when he first got the job or poaching Denbrock last season. Granted, there were strong personal connections with both of them, but I appreciate this as a program flex move. Plus, hasn’t Knowles now beaten Freeman four years in a row (or was he gone from Okie State by the bowl?). Freeman has seen the evolution of the OSU defense up close and I’m sure respects the hell out of Knowles. If we were to pull this off, we’d be getting the No. 1 defense coordinator one season after landing the No. 1 offense coordinator.
Side question: If landing Knowles means losing Mickens on top of Golden, is it worth the tradeoff?
He was gone by the bowl. Left in the 1st or 2nd week of Dec.
by Domer99, John Wesley Powell's Expedition Island, Friday, January 24, 2025, 07:59 (13 days ago) @ BPH
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Needs to be a pass first DC
by Mike (bart), Friday, January 24, 2025, 07:28 (13 days ago) @ HumanRobot
The universe of teams who are going to be able to beat an ND-quality front 7 that plays good D, tackles and leverages the ball is so small it might not exist. All value add is to be found in stopping passing game. Not super interested in a guy like the Indiana dude who basically works the front 7 and just plays zone behind it
any thoughts on Leonhard?
by HumanRobot , Cybertron, Friday, January 24, 2025, 07:35 (13 days ago) @ Mike (bart)
Sounds very similar to Golden. I think Leonhard runs more simulated pressures.
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I'm a bad take machine!
Did a clinic session with him about 10 years ago
by Mike (bart), Friday, January 24, 2025, 07:40 (13 days ago) @ HumanRobot
I was very impressed with him personally. He knows NFL back end stuff. He was pretty good at pass efficiency defense at Wisconsin but started to slip toward the end. My fear would be that he's most well-versed in the prior regime of match-quarters, which kind of got solved by hurry-up/RPO stuff.
I can't remember where I read it, but there are some
by BillyGoat, At Thanksgiving with Joe Bethersontin, Friday, January 24, 2025, 07:40 (13 days ago) @ HumanRobot
significant concerns about Leonard's enthusiasm for recruiting.
I'm not worried about DC recruiting
by Greg, seemingly ranch, Friday, January 24, 2025, 10:13 (13 days ago) @ BillyGoat
Or OC for that matter. In the new world of NIL/portal/whathaveyou, the HC has to do way more of that than in the old world, making coordinator a place where older guys who don't want to recruit can park themselves and just focus on football. Heck, it's why I thought Golden might be at ND longer - lots of money and the ability to leave recruiting to the position coaches and Freeman.
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The 2007 ND-UCLA game was a once in a lifetime experience, I hope
Completely agree.
by Savage, Around Ye Olde Colonial College, Friday, January 24, 2025, 10:22 (13 days ago) @ Greg
For a coordinator, give me a tactical genius who can teach his scheme and get his players to understand and execute it. If that means he spends 80 hours a week holed up in the football offices and practice fields, instead of on the road recruiting or glad-handing or what have you, I'm okay with it.
Let the HC and position coaches and, as appropriate/legal dedicated recruiting staff to the flying all over the country, texting and Zooming and whatever with every kid and their mom (literally), being the fiery sideline motivator/ass-kicker, etc.
isn't recruiting pretty institutional at ND at this point?
by HumanRobot , Cybertron, Friday, January 24, 2025, 07:44 (13 days ago) @ BillyGoat
You don't pay Bowden et. al the big bucks to rule out DCs based on recruiting concerns, IMO.
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I'm a bad take machine!
I think Bowden and Davis can absorb some of the grind. But
by BillyGoat, At Thanksgiving with Joe Bethersontin, Friday, January 24, 2025, 08:22 (13 days ago) @ HumanRobot
I think the needle-mover for elite kids is often relationships with the HC and coordinators. And that's just the outside recruiting.
Every coach needs to be "recruiting" (in terms of strengthening relationships and managing personalities) everybody in the building every day. There's more recruiting than ever before.
sounds like Chip Kelly favorite for Jaguars OC position
by HumanRobot , Cybertron, Friday, January 24, 2025, 04:59 (14 days ago) @ Romulox
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I'm a bad take machine!
I love Mickens work
by HumanRobot , Cybertron, Friday, January 24, 2025, 03:55 (14 days ago) @ Romulox
But with how the DC position is funded and with how much talent we have on D, you have to exhaust any and all slam dunk candidates.
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I'm a bad take machine!
Definitely a legitimate source
by Jeremy (WeIsND), Offices of Babip Pecota Vorp & Eckstein, Thursday, January 23, 2025, 19:29 (14 days ago) @ Romulox
Brice and Co. have perhaps the best contacts of any website when it comes to coaching news.
Brice has connections
by Domer99, John Wesley Powell's Expedition Island, Thursday, January 23, 2025, 20:16 (14 days ago) @ Jeremy (WeIsND)
Most of them are agents. But Brice also believes Mickens will get a good look at DC.
He sounded legitimately surprised
by Jeremy (WeIsND), Offices of Babip Pecota Vorp & Eckstein, Thursday, January 23, 2025, 20:17 (14 days ago) @ Domer99
When Sampson mentioned that he didn't necessarily think Mickens was a sure thing, and that ND intended to look elsewhere.
Would we go to $3.2/yr? Probably lose Mickens
by JD in Portland , Portland OR, Thursday, January 23, 2025, 20:09 (14 days ago) @ Jeremy (WeIsND)
Sounds like OK may be the spot if be jumps. Gf and all.
Don’t really understand why he’d leave OSU if they come close in pay which they certainly can afford.
It’s a crazy world out there
Never can tell anyone's motivations
by Domer99, John Wesley Powell's Expedition Island, Thursday, January 23, 2025, 20:18 (14 days ago) @ JD in Portland
I think Golden will take less money and less long-term certainty to be Cincy's DC.
Yes it’s not obvious to me
by Larz, Friday, January 24, 2025, 05:27 (14 days ago) @ Domer99
Why Knowles would leave a team where he just won a national championship, with substantial resources for a lateral move. At least with Golden he’s going to the NFL.
I can only assume the thought is Knowles would leave simply for money. Maybe its a Mike Elko type situation? Not sure if pursuing the latest big name mercenary coach, chasing the most dollars is the right way to go for the program. But who knows?
On the II pod Brice has stated
by hobbs, San Diego, CA, Friday, January 24, 2025, 06:09 (14 days ago) @ Larz
that there are/were hierarchy issues on the OSU staff. Some have mentioned Knowles and Larry Johnson (long time DL coach) not getting along.
So there are issues there, besides the potential payday, that may prompt Knowles to leave.
Clearly something is going one with Knowles
by Domer99, John Wesley Powell's Expedition Island, Friday, January 24, 2025, 07:51 (13 days ago) @ hobbs
Because there was chatter before the MNC game that he was in line to be Oklahoma's next DC. Add Penn St. and ND as other potential suitors and it starts to feel like it's more than just an agent trying to bid up his client.
Could be both.
by Tim, Chicago, IL, Friday, January 24, 2025, 09:16 (13 days ago) @ Domer99
Perhaps the Oklahoma talk is and was legit, but now his agent is upping the price by dragging other blue-blood names into the conversation, even if they are not actually bidding.
Interesting, thanks!
by Larz, Friday, January 24, 2025, 07:32 (13 days ago) @ hobbs
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FWIW, Brice mentioned OSU 'hierarchy' issues
by hobbs, San Diego, CA, Friday, January 24, 2025, 08:12 (13 days ago) @ Larz
on both sides of the ball. On offense, former OC and current OL coach, Justin Frye had issues with his replacement Chip Kelly.
Ohio St. is one of those weird places
by Domer99, John Wesley Powell's Expedition Island, Friday, January 24, 2025, 08:26 (13 days ago) @ hobbs
Like a Michigan where there is definitely an aspect of respecting the university legacies and alums like Tressell, Myer, etc.. And then the guys who played and coached for them so your Hartlines, Laurinaitis, etc.
But Chip Kelly fits differently as he was Ryan Day's coach at New Hampshire. And Kelly doesn't strike me as the type of guy who cares at all about aOSU and all their history and fanfare.
Kelly was always a marriage of convenience.
by KGB, Belly o. the Beast, Friday, January 24, 2025, 08:49 (13 days ago) @ Domer99
It shouldn't surprise anyone that he may have viewed the OSU job as a stepping stone to escape back to the NFL and run screaming from the stuff about college ball that's always given him hives. Just needed the juice to be given the opportunity.
There's also an element to football coaches at this level once they've reached the mountaintop and might get fidgety to seek out a new challenge.
This whole season was the culmination
by Jeremy (WeIsND), Offices of Babip Pecota Vorp & Eckstein, Friday, January 24, 2025, 09:00 (13 days ago) @ KGB
Of the perfect storm of events for OSU. Convincing all that NFL talent to come back for one more ride. Taking advantage of Saban retiring to poach the best defensive player in the portal. Convincing Chip Kelly to come call plays for one season to polish his resume to return to the NFL. Hanging onto Hartline even though you keep taking on-field responsibilities from him.
In retrospect, it all worked out to get them a title, but its pretty interesting how closely they came to blowing everything. And how its probably never going to align like this for them again.
When's our turn?
by Chris , Raleigh, NC, Friday, January 24, 2025, 10:08 (13 days ago) @ Jeremy (WeIsND)
Because the last two season (and corresponding Champions) are starting to make me lose hope.
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"F--- everyone who isn't us."
#Team128
This year had whiffs
by Jeremy (WeIsND), Offices of Babip Pecota Vorp & Eckstein, Friday, January 24, 2025, 11:32 (13 days ago) @ Chris
Best coaching staff in a long while, unicorn transfer QB, unicorn generational safety, incredible CB play the likes of which we haven't seen in decades, one of the best RBs ever to don the helmet.
But I think we look pretty locked and loaded for 2026. If Carr is the QB, it will be Year 2. Much of the OL talent will still be around and will be multi-year starters. Hopefully someone among that group grabs the leadership reins and convinces everyone to stick around for the ride. Greathouse and Faison will still be here. On defense, Bryce Young, KVA, Moore will be juniors and (hopefully) AA candidates. Maybe Traore decides to stick around.
I'm not sure that we can realistically expect Freeman to be around much longer than that.
thinking about it
by HumanRobot , Cybertron, Friday, January 24, 2025, 05:46 (14 days ago) @ Larz
- Sounds like Kelly is also leaving OSU. Maybe the OSU environment isn't a place guys want to be long term, especially since they can leave with the ring.
- 3 years is pretty long for a coordinator
- If he really wants to leave OSU, ND is the best football spot of OU and PSU.
- As you and Mike suggest, this is most likely this is a "University of Leverage" situation.
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I'm a bad take machine!
Smells like agent work to me
by Mike (bart), Friday, January 24, 2025, 05:40 (14 days ago) @ Larz
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Orc mischief
by BillyGoat, At Thanksgiving with Joe Bethersontin, Friday, January 24, 2025, 08:24 (13 days ago) @ Mike (bart)
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FWIW, Brice’s wife works at ND
by Dallasdomer, Thursday, January 23, 2025, 19:52 (14 days ago) @ Jeremy (WeIsND)
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