Riggs brings us to 85

by Jay ⌂, San Diego, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 10:35 (3690 days ago)

Prospective balance...

total offense: 38

3 QB
5 RB
10 WR
5 TE
9 C/OG
6 OT

total defense: 44

14 DL
7 OLB
7 ILB
8 CB
8 S

total specialists: 3

2 K
1 LS

drawing a line on non-players

by Jay ⌂, San Diego, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 11:09 (3690 days ago) @ Jay

Last year, Drew mentioned the grading system ND uses to evaluate its roster:

http://www.bluegraysky.com/forum/index.php?mode=entry&id=163225

...every snap is filmed and graded for every player (games, practice). They then rank every player as a star, starter, key backup, backup, needs improvement (I can't remember the last one, it wasn't needs improvement, but it wasn't flattering). Stars play 80-100% of the snaps. Starters play 75-90% of the snaps. Key Backups play 25-40% of the snaps. Backups play 5-15% of the snaps. The last guys don't play. Every player knows his score and ranking. So all things being equal, every guy knows their expectations going into Saturday. The grade is constantly fluctuating, and guys move up and down...

You can think about these designations independent of whether thin depth would force someone to play more snaps ahead of his development. Take middle linebacker for instance. Grace is one obvious starter (S). The next tier guys like Moore, Schmidt, and Deeb should probably be "key backups" (KB) or just backups (B) -- instead, 1 or 2 of these guys will likely get more snaps than desired. Martini, Sykes, and Morgan should be redshirting, but Morgan will likely play, too.

In any case, there are probably more "ready to play" players above the line on this roster than any in recent memory. Remember these designations are "should be" ratings in an ideal situation.

QB - 1 starter, 1 key backup, 1 non-player
4 Golson (S)
2 Zaire (KB)
1 Kizer (NP)

RB - 3 potential starter quality guys, 1 key backup in Carlisle, 1 backup
4 McDaniel (S)
4 Carlisle (KB)
3 Mahone (B)
2 Bryant (S)
2 Folston (S)

WR - I see one starter and then a slew of backup snaps, with only 1 guy clearly destined for a redshirt (Holmes) and only 1 obvious non-player (Massa).
5 Massa (NP)
4 Daniels (S)
3 C. Brown (KB)
3 Prosise (KB)
2 Onwualu KB)
2 C. Robinson (KB)
2 Fuller (KB)
2 Hunter (B)
1 Brent (B)
1 Holmes (NP)

TE - 1 obvious starter, 2 should-be backups who will probably play more than advised
4 Koyack (S)
2 Heuerman (B)
2 Smythe (B)
1 Weishar (NP)
1 Luatua (NP)

C/OG - 3 starter quality guys, the rest backups except for one. Impressive depth here.
4 N. Martin (S)
4 Hanratty (S)
4 Hegarty (S)
3 Harrell (B)
2 McGovern (B)
2 Bivin (B)
2 Montelus (B)
1 Byrne (B)
1 Mustipher (NP)

OT - again, three starter quality guys, a couple of backups, plus one NP who could probably play in a pinch (Nelson).
5 Lombard (S)
3 Stanley (S)
2 Elmer (S)
2 McGlinchey (B)
1 Nelson (NP)
1 Bars (NP)

DT/DE - Very thin. I count 1 bona fide starter (Day), although a few will end up with starter snaps. Tabbing Hayes and Trumbetti as Backups already, which isn't ideal.
5 Utupo (B)
4 Hounshell (?)
4 Springmann (KB)
3 Day (S)
3 J. Jones (KB)
2 Matuska (B)
2 Rochell (KB)
1 Hayes (B)
1 Trumbetti (B)
1 Bonner (NP)
1 Blankenship (NP)
1 J. Williams (NP)
1 Mokwuah (NP)
1 Cage (NP)

OLB - Two starters in Ishaq and Jaylon, but some good backup depth here (if certain guys are healthy).
4 I. Williams (S)
4 Councell (KB)
4 Rabasa (B)
3 Okwara (KB)
2 J. Smith (S)
2 Randolph (B)
1 K. Hill (NP)

ILB - way too thin. One bona fide starter coming off injury, the rest are backups at best.
5 Moore (B)
4 Grace (S)
4 Schmidt (B)
2 Deeb (B)
1 Martini (NP)
1 Sykes (NP)
1 Morgan (B)

CB - excellent depth here considering 2 players will eat up most of the snaps.
4 J. Atkinson (B)
4 J. Brown (B)
3 K. Russell (S)
2 Kinlaw (B)
2 Butler (KB)
2 Luke (KB)
1 Watkins (NP)
5 Riggs (S)

S - some experience here, but the older guys are ideally key backups, not starters. potential superstar in Redfield.
5 Collinsworth (KB)
4 Hardy (KB)
4 Farley (KB)
3 Baratti (KB)
3 Shumate (KB)
3 Turner (B)
2 Redfield (S)
1 Tranquill (NP)

Tags:
roster

My guess is we'll have a few more "KB" guys after spring

by Jack @, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 14:55 (3690 days ago) @ Jay

practice ends.

My primary candidates would be Hunter and Smythe or Heuerman.

I honestly doubt Morgan would redshirt anywhere

by scriptcomesfirst @, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 14:24 (3690 days ago) @ Jay

He's not a 5 year guy by any stretch of the imagination. Should he be a prospective starter? Probably not, but RS was never in the calculus.

Guys like that start the first game playing special teams

by Mark, O Town, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 16:29 (3690 days ago) @ scriptcomesfirst

by game 3 they're getting some PT at their true position and by the end of the season they are a starter or a very key backup.

interesting ... do we have to have a starter?

by Mark, O Town, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 13:03 (3690 days ago) @ Jay

...every snap is filmed and graded for every player (games, practice). They then rank every player as a star, starter, key backup, backup, needs improvement (I can't remember the last one, it wasn't needs improvement, but it wasn't flattering). Stars play 80-100% of the snaps. Starters play 75-90% of the snaps. Key Backups play 25-40% of the snaps. Backups play 5-15% of the snaps. The last guys don't play. Every player knows his score and ranking. So all things being equal, every guy knows their expectations going into Saturday. The grade is constantly fluctuating, and guys move up and down...


Similar to the TE's where you don't list a "Key Backup", but only backups, certainly there are times when someone doesn't "Grade out" high enough, right?

Or is there some portion of the grade that is position based and should TE have a "Key Backup" and only one "Starter", just because player ABC is #1 and player XYZ is #2?

so out of the guys in their 2nd year or older

by Jay ⌂, San Diego, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 11:13 (3690 days ago) @ Jay

I count only one player who's a definite NP (Massa), with a couple of other likely (Turner, Atkinson, J. Brown, Mahone, Harrell). Basically we're not carrying many who are obvious non-players, as we have with recent rosters.

I would list Jones as an (S)

by Mike (bart), Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 11:19 (3690 days ago) @ Jay

He basically started at NG the final 1/3rd of the season. Additionally, I would consider upgrading Councell to (KB/S) quality

And even Luke Massa has an important job on the team

by Jim (fisherj08) @, A Samoan kid's laptop, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 11:15 (3690 days ago) @ Jay

(signaling in plays/holding for special teams)

I may be wrong

by crazychester @, Chicago, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 10:45 (3690 days ago) @ Jay

but have we ever been full before ?

I know Willingham damn near self-imposed draconian NCAA penalties but I dont' thin ND has ever got all the way to 85....always seem to get close but not quite there.

definitely not in recent memory

by Jay ⌂, San Diego, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 10:48 (3690 days ago) @ crazychester
edited by Jay, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 11:56

Our rough count (probably not 100% accurate):

[s]2011 - 69 (way off)
2012 - 77[/s]
2013 - 81
2014 - 85

That 2011 number can't be right. As of Troy's signing

by BillyGoat, At Thanksgiving with Joe Bethersontin, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 11:55 (3690 days ago) @ Jay

his NLOI, we had 85 guys on scholarship. Then we lost Montana. I don't know who else we lost before the season, but I'm sure we had 80 or so for kickoff against USF on the Indian Burial Ground.

The Indian Burial Ground....that's good.

by crazychester @, Chicago, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 12:23 (3690 days ago) @ BillyGoat

If Notre Dame ever plays a game that is a worse overall experience, it just might do me in.

I'm weirdly glad I was at that one.

by Mike (Embrey), Mountain Holler, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 14:03 (3690 days ago) @ crazychester

Even Quint would flinch if he heard that story.

[image]

Best seats I've ever had

by IrishGuard, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 19:07 (3690 days ago) @ Mike (Embrey)

After the second rain delay, the wife and I just walked in and sat about 15 rows up right on the 50, right next to Chris Collinsworth.

We lost. It sucked. But good seats.

definitely on my all-time Weird/Amazing game list

by Jay ⌂, San Diego, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 15:09 (3690 days ago) @ Mike (Embrey)
edited by Jay, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 15:14

along with the Bush Push, a Cards/Dodgers forfeit, power going out at ND-ASU, last year's WS game 4, and a random meaningless game at PNC where the Pirates came back to win down six runs with two outs in the bottom of the ninth.

Tulsa 2010 was the weirdest game I've ever attended.

by LaFortune Teller ⌂ @, South Bend, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 19:02 (3690 days ago) @ Jay

Tulsa offensive drive results that day:
TD
FG
Punt
Missed FG
Punt
Fumble
Punt
End of Half
Fumble
Punt
Punt
Punt
Punt
FG
End of Game

28-27 Tulsa

definitely not - it's crossed out

by Jay ⌂, San Diego, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 11:56 (3690 days ago) @ BillyGoat

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How did we get so low in 2011?

by Mike (bart), Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 10:59 (3690 days ago) @ Jay

We really have 25% more players now than we did then?

Budget cuts.

by Bill, Murrieta, CA, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 11:34 (3690 days ago) @ Mike (bart)

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that number could be way off

by Jay ⌂, San Diego, Wednesday, February 19, 2014, 11:09 (3690 days ago) @ Mike (bart)

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