Why?
I'm not trying to troll, and forgive my "bad personality", I'm just hoping that perhaps you might have a more thorough answer than I received elsewhere on the board.
Why do luxury boxes have no place in college football? Is there something about college football or the American university model that should preclude wining and dining of potential donors during the marquee social events of the year? Is there something about college football that means corporations and big donors shouldn't be able to get some accommodation for giving the University large sums of money? Is there something that's bad for the football program, or the University at large, about having rich people enjoying the game in the stadium? Is there something harmful to the football program, or University at large, about having different sections of fans in different accommodations with different price points? Is there something fundamentally wrong with showcasing the student athletes to the economic and societal elite?
How does a Catholic university change the calculus? Must we start at first principles of whether a Catholic institution running a major sports program is moral endangerment? If not, then we can begin with the differentiation of a Catholic university versus an arbitrary university explored above. Is there something morally scandalous about a Catholic university wining and dining potential donors during football games? Is there something morally dangerous or wrong about providing tickets and accommodations to corporate partners and existing and potential donors? Even understanding the moral and societal dangers of "unfettered capitalism", in the words of our new Pontiff, is there something specific about private boxes that makes them morally wrong, or is it only the second-order association with presumed-guilty-unless-proven-innocent capitalists that bothers you? Is there any moral consideration whatsoever with bisecting the football game watching experience of fans in the stadium, and if so, how is this any different from the bisection that already exists by not providing tickets for free to all comers?
Complete thread:
- Well, that boondoggle was quite a boon -
Domer99,
2014-01-30, 08:55
- Did the Pope scold us? -
Slainte Joe,
2014-01-30, 09:56
- I took it as a "keep fighting the good fight" comment -
Samari,
2014-01-30, 10:03
- So did I. -
Slainte Joe,
2014-01-30, 10:07
- I can't really follow Rocco's logic -
Samari,
2014-01-30, 10:23
- I think he's saying we got fussed at... - Slainte Joe, 2014-01-30, 11:12
- I can't really follow Rocco's logic -
Samari,
2014-01-30, 10:23
- So did I. -
Slainte Joe,
2014-01-30, 10:07
- I took it as a "keep fighting the good fight" comment -
Samari,
2014-01-30, 10:03
- What an egregious waste of our Notre Dame tax dollars. -
KGB,
2014-01-30, 09:50
- ha - Jay, 2014-01-30, 10:20
- I hope you kids see what a silly waste of resources -
BillyGoat,
2014-01-30, 09:57
- He worked really hard, BillGoat. -
oaknd1,
2014-01-30, 15:58
- So do washing machines. - BillyGoat, 2014-01-30, 16:03
- Ole Miss can teach us something about better uses -
Domer99,
2014-01-30, 10:02
- Being old, the first thing that came to mind for me was -
Jack,
2014-01-30, 12:33
- Yeah, well, I bet you there is more than -
Grantland,
2014-01-30, 12:37
- Oh, no doubt, but 50 years ago - Jack, 2014-01-30, 14:52
- Yeah, well, I bet you there is more than -
Grantland,
2014-01-30, 12:37
- Poor form ... - Mark, 2014-01-30, 10:11
- Being old, the first thing that came to mind for me was -
Jack,
2014-01-30, 12:33
- He worked really hard, BillGoat. -
oaknd1,
2014-01-30, 15:58
- Where does he stand on field turf/JumboTron? - Pete, 2014-01-30, 09:06
- essay question -
Jay,
2014-01-30, 09:06
- Yes - Geoff, 2014-01-30, 13:06
- What's the return on the investment going to be? - Samari, 2014-01-30, 09:53
- Side note. -
FunkDoctorSpock,
2014-01-30, 09:26
- Was that a good idea? -
Kevin,
2014-01-30, 10:11
- Unequivocally - James, 2014-01-31, 07:08
- I know. That was my point. But I'm sure you know that. - FunkDoctorSpock, 2014-01-30, 11:29
- Well done - Brendan, 2014-01-30, 11:27
- Wow. That's pretty good -
Mike (bart),
2014-01-30, 10:13
- You guys are all a bunch of f***ing Calvinists! - Slainte Joe, 2014-01-30, 12:16
- meanwhile, Francis is bunking in the rectory - Jay, 2014-01-30, 09:50
- Seems like a great Shamrock Series site. - Jim (fisherj08), 2014-01-30, 09:42
- Was that a good idea? -
Kevin,
2014-01-30, 10:11
- I have to be honest -
Domer99,
2014-01-30, 09:16
- I think it's good to test priorities from time to time -
Jay,
2014-01-30, 09:31
- The student debt thing is really becoming -
Mike (bart),
2014-01-30, 10:00
- Yes, it is. - oviedoirish, 2014-01-30, 10:48
- The ivies have been stepping in that direction. -
PAK,
2014-01-30, 10:25
- You could argue the Stadium as "the final piece" -
irishoutsider,
2014-01-30, 10:47
- That's what I'm sorta hoping for. - PAK, 2014-01-30, 11:12
- Yeah, well ... -
Savage,
2014-01-30, 10:42
- I can understand why some people are cagey about research - Samari, 2014-01-30, 11:17
- Agreed on all counts. - PAK, 2014-01-30, 11:10
- You could argue the Stadium as "the final piece" -
irishoutsider,
2014-01-30, 10:47
- The idea of Catholicism seems to frequently invite... - Domer99, 2014-01-30, 09:42
- The student debt thing is really becoming -
Mike (bart),
2014-01-30, 10:00
- so your essay response is 'Get used to it' -
HumanRobot,
2014-01-30, 09:21
- If I felt stronger about the concept then maybe that would -
Domer99,
2014-01-30, 09:29
- I don't even think it's "wrong" per se -
Jay,
2014-01-30, 09:34
- I was thinking this morning about the campus growth, and... -
Greg,
2014-01-30, 09:44
- The trade off -
CK08,
2014-01-30, 10:41
- Good points, and PAK, yes I have... -
Greg,
2014-01-30, 11:23
- I've been on UM, MSU, and ND's campuses in the last year. -
PAK,
2014-01-30, 11:42
- One nit re Michigan State - Jack, 2014-01-30, 15:10
- Ah - Greg, 2014-01-30, 11:54
- North of the river, MSU's campus is pretty nice - CK08, 2014-01-30, 11:50
- I've been on UM, MSU, and ND's campuses in the last year. -
PAK,
2014-01-30, 11:42
- Good points, and PAK, yes I have... -
Greg,
2014-01-30, 11:23
- Have you ever spent any time on any other college campus? - PAK, 2014-01-30, 10:28
- The trade off -
CK08,
2014-01-30, 10:41
- I was thinking this morning about the campus growth, and... -
Greg,
2014-01-30, 09:44
- I don't even think it's "wrong" per se -
Jay,
2014-01-30, 09:34
- If I felt stronger about the concept then maybe that would -
Domer99,
2014-01-30, 09:29
- I think it's good to test priorities from time to time -
Jay,
2014-01-30, 09:31
- 22 second response from Rome - KelleyCook, 2014-01-30, 09:12
- Seriously? -
Savage,
2014-01-30, 09:09
- What's not serious about the question? -
Dylan,
2014-01-30, 09:28
- That question goes way beyond the Crossroads project -
CK08,
2014-01-30, 09:42
- Seems like a good conversation starter. - Dylan, 2014-01-30, 09:51
- That question goes way beyond the Crossroads project -
CK08,
2014-01-30, 09:42
- extra credit: -
Jay,
2014-01-30, 09:15
- What's its mission statement? -
Geoff,
2014-01-30, 13:09
- see v - Grantland, 2014-01-30, 13:40
- Whole lot more than 100 words: - Grantland, 2014-01-30, 11:12
- OK - Greg, 2014-01-30, 09:34
- To be the best Catholic University in the country. -
Jim (fisherj08),
2014-01-30, 09:23
- I do think that an element of being elite university -
JRT,
2014-01-31, 07:01
- That's also a good point. - Kevin, 2014-01-31, 07:04
- with liberty for all and luxury boxes for very very few -
JD in Portland,
2014-01-30, 09:31
- There is just something so purely capitalistic about -
Grantland,
2014-01-30, 11:17
- i hate to sound hyperbolic but -
JD in Portland,
2014-01-30, 11:41
- Why? -
Savage,
2014-01-30, 11:53
- To me it feels wrong but I am not so sure why. -
Grantland,
2014-01-30, 12:19
- Notre Dame does stem cell research -
Jim (fisherj08),
2014-01-30, 12:21
- UGH! I knew I might mess that one up - and I do not -
Grantland,
2014-01-30, 12:24
- On the contrary! -
Jim (fisherj08),
2014-01-30, 12:25
- Okay - But my larger point remains the slippery slope and - Grantland, 2014-01-30, 12:34
- On the contrary! -
Jim (fisherj08),
2014-01-30, 12:25
- UGH! I knew I might mess that one up - and I do not -
Grantland,
2014-01-30, 12:24
- Notre Dame does stem cell research -
Jim (fisherj08),
2014-01-30, 12:21
- To me it feels wrong but I am not so sure why. -
Grantland,
2014-01-30, 12:19
- Are you being serious JD? -
Grantland,
2014-01-30, 11:52
- this is a really good discussion down here - Jay, 2014-01-31, 08:01
- yes -
JD in Portland,
2014-01-30, 16:27
- Self-evident for you, perhaps. -
Savage,
2014-01-30, 17:15
- I'll try to chime in -
JRT,
2014-01-31, 07:06
- Here's the thing -
CK08,
2014-01-31, 07:32
- Not to mention the costs of lodging, food, travel, etc. -
Jim (fisherj08),
2014-01-31, 07:34
- I haven't been to a home game since 2006 -
Greg,
2014-01-31, 08:15
- Think of the crowd you see walking around on gameday - Mike (bart), 2014-01-31, 08:39
- I haven't been to a home game since 2006 -
Greg,
2014-01-31, 08:15
- Not to mention the costs of lodging, food, travel, etc. -
Jim (fisherj08),
2014-01-31, 07:34
- Here's the thing -
CK08,
2014-01-31, 07:32
- thanks for the name calling -
JD in Portland,
2014-01-30, 19:20
- Your argument would be more compelling -
CK08,
2014-01-31, 07:22
- Considering these one-by-one -
Kevin,
2014-01-31, 07:38
- Good analysis - CK08, 2014-01-31, 08:01
- These cost estimates can be estimated -
Mike (bart),
2014-01-31, 07:57
- Also, ND's cost PSF probably needs to be evaluated -
CK08,
2014-01-31, 08:02
- Another consideration: -
Jim (fisherj08),
2014-01-31, 08:06
- The front nine of the Burke? - Grantland, 2014-01-31, 08:29
- I was wondering about those - Jay, 2014-01-31, 08:19
- This is a key part of the argument -
Mike (bart),
2014-01-31, 08:18
- the 2008 master plan showed buildings in that area -
Jay,
2014-01-31, 08:20
- Linked here -
Kevin,
2014-01-31, 08:21
- I think NDXC means they're going to have to issue -
Mike (bart),
2014-01-31, 08:33
- The student activities center that was originally - LaFortune Teller, 2014-01-31, 11:51
- I think NDXC means they're going to have to issue -
Mike (bart),
2014-01-31, 08:33
- Linked here -
Kevin,
2014-01-31, 08:21
- the 2008 master plan showed buildings in that area -
Jay,
2014-01-31, 08:20
- Another consideration: -
Jim (fisherj08),
2014-01-31, 08:06
- Also, ND's cost PSF probably needs to be evaluated -
CK08,
2014-01-31, 08:02
- This response kind of gets at the heart of the issue -
Jim (fisherj08),
2014-01-31, 07:49
- First, I think you've reversed the burden on this question. -
Kevin,
2014-01-31, 07:52
- Sure, the current rec center is fine - Samari, 2014-01-31, 08:29
- As someone who likes playing hoops, but isn't good at it - CK08, 2014-01-31, 08:05
- First, I think you've reversed the burden on this question. -
Kevin,
2014-01-31, 07:52
- Considering these one-by-one -
Kevin,
2014-01-31, 07:38
- Agree. - Kevin, 2014-01-31, 03:38
- But your argument only makes sense -
Samari,
2014-01-30, 22:48
- I think the fear is that the -
Mike (bart),
2014-01-31, 06:31
- Here's my question (or series of questions) -
CK08,
2014-01-31, 07:18
- "shoehorned in as a way to make luxury boxes palatable..." -
Kevin,
2014-01-31, 07:22
- exactly what I stated below - and mayube why it - Grantland, 2014-01-31, 08:36
- That's probably true - CK08, 2014-01-31, 07:25
- "shoehorned in as a way to make luxury boxes palatable..." -
Kevin,
2014-01-31, 07:22
- If we're going down that road -
Jim (fisherj08),
2014-01-31, 06:40
- Universities have football for 1 reason: Advertising. - PAK, 2014-01-31, 07:34
- This is why Jay wants us to keep diaries on the board - Mike (bart), 2014-01-31, 06:51
- Very well put. - Kevin, 2014-01-31, 06:35
- Here's my question (or series of questions) -
CK08,
2014-01-31, 07:18
- I can see both sides of the argument. - Grantland, 2014-01-31, 02:10
- I think the fear is that the -
Mike (bart),
2014-01-31, 06:31
- A lot of this spending is going towards addressing academics - Jim (fisherj08), 2014-01-30, 19:36
- Your argument would be more compelling -
CK08,
2014-01-31, 07:22
- I'll try to chime in -
JRT,
2014-01-31, 07:06
- Self-evident for you, perhaps. -
Savage,
2014-01-30, 17:15
- Why? -
Savage,
2014-01-30, 11:53
- i hate to sound hyperbolic but -
JD in Portland,
2014-01-30, 11:41
- There is just something so purely capitalistic about -
Grantland,
2014-01-30, 11:17
- I do think that an element of being elite university -
JRT,
2014-01-31, 07:01
- What's its mission statement? -
Geoff,
2014-01-30, 13:09
- What's not serious about the question? -
Dylan,
2014-01-30, 09:28
- Did the Pope scold us? -
Slainte Joe,
2014-01-30, 09:56