and Delaware State and UMass and App State and teams of that nature, then maybe their students would show up to games.

I suspect our reasoning for going to GA had a lot to do with ushers simply getting tired of trying to kick people out of seats they shouldn't be in.

My impression was always that going to the game was expected. If you didn't go, there was something defective about your sensibilities. Plus, if you don't go, what else is there to do?

All that said, I did have one friend who didn't go to games (and didn't buy tickets). He was a huge football (and ND) fan, and it wasn't a money thing. He honestly just preferred to tailgate, then go back to the dorm and watch the game on TV.

(all fans for that matter) are there for the opening kick and stay until after the singing of the alma mater. All I have is anecdotal evidence, but I bet our numbers compared to most other BCS schools would further separate ND.

Would UM students pay full GA price or still get a discount?

FWIW, here at UCF we have a different situation. We have a 45,000 seat stadium and 60,000 students. However, although attendance is getting better, our avg. attendance for non-big games is about 25,000. That's for everyone, not just students. Students can purchase a 6-game season ticket pkg for $60. But for many of the low attendance games, students get in free. For the games that are televised on a weeknight, faculty often get in free as well, to make the stadium look more full. For the games that sell out, there is a student lottery. Approximately 15,000 tickets are allocated for students, and I believe that the lottery winners get in free. If we continue to get better and do well in the "Big East" (whatever it's called now), then I'm sure tickets will become more expensive/harder to get for students (and everyone).

Only reasons 95% of the students wouldn't show up is if they're too drunk or get arrested for being too drunk.

The games around fall break may be lower -- likely due to freshmen moms not knowing that there are football games around that time and booking a flight ahead of time.

- No text -

Even the students who don't like football to begin with get caught up in it because everyone else embraces football. Michigan is an entirely different animal. It's a state university that has to pander to a lot of different constituencies, some of whom have little desire to attend football games.

Among BCS programs, I am going to guess that there isn't a larger student attendance ratio at any other school in America. Notre Dame allots 8.5 sections for the students (sections 28-36, http://www.und.com/facilities/nd-stadium-seating-chart.html ), which comprise 10,795 seats ( http://www.und.com/facilities/nd-stadium.html ). That's compared to an undergraduate enrollment of 8,371. That's nearly a 130% attendance rate using the undergrad enrollment as a measure.

Now, I realize that St. Mary's and graduate students are factored into the 10,795 number, so it's really not fair to claim such an attendance rate that actually exceeds the enrollment but it's an astounding number to think about.

It basically means that the students nearly universally embrace football as a part of the culture.

I realize I am getting a little off topic as the original question was about student turnout rates and arrival times. But I think the raw numbers kind of speak to the point tangentially if not anecdotally. Regardless of what people want to say about the changing composition of the student body, it still remains that the student body values football and shows up at a clip much higher than any other BCS program.

- No text -

- No text -

If you're telling me that UM can get 75% of their students with tix to watch Akron on a sunny September day, then I'm calling you a pig-faced liar.

I'd be surprised if it's even 5%.

Even for the non-football fans, there is still the very strong social aspect of going to games at ND. And may it be ever thus.

Not that you asked, my theory on why student attendance is not as high at basketball games as it was when I was at ND, when student seats were sold out every year, is due to two factors, both important. One is obvious: we had great teams. But the second is that there are about 600 fewer men per class now than there were then. Just looking at my immediate family - I have three sisters who went to ND. One of the three is a sports fan. The other two wouldn't know if a football is pumped with air or stuffed with feathers despite not only attending ND but living in the same house as my dad and my brother - AND one of them marrying a fellow ND grad. Yet they didn't miss football games (well, one did, but that even amplifies the point). If either of them ever went to a basketball game in four years at ND, I'd be shocked. As for my daughter, same thing. She never missed a football game and wouldn't dream of it. She went to exactly one basketball game.

of all future ND-Michigan discussions I take part in.

I can tell you that my younger brother, a rising senior at Michigan, is constantly frustrated by his friends who never bother to show up to games, because getting drunk is more fun. He only has two people who he goes to games with each and every week.

On the other hand (and maybe things have changed since I graduated in 2008?), going to football games was *the* most important thing in the world. Everyone shows up, because that's what is expected of you.